SPEAKER_02: 0:40

Oregon media.

SPEAKER_04: 0:44

So I am a skier, climber, mountain biker, surfer, and I sleep a lot in the back of my car. And I never like really liked it that much. But like when you're at a trailhead, you can't do much, you can't really pop a tent, and I can't afford a rooftop tent because they're like a thousand dollars. And so I was like, I'm gonna make a tent for the back of my car. Um and I just did the whole project on it. We did like the the costing, the design, all that stuff in class. Um and then I was like, I actually want to make this. Um and then Kate was like, okay, let's let's do it. Um and that's when we got our first tent. We cut it apart. Uh I just taped it up to my car.

SPEAKER_06: 1:25

And then patterning it was a nightmare. Yeah. Because all of those like curves and it's all organic shapes, and it you it's hard, you can't really measure the angles on it.

SPEAKER_04: 1:35

I also don't have patience, so I didn't draft a pattern first, like Kate was telling me to do. Um, I just started cutting and taping.

SPEAKER_06: 1:42

Yeah, that was really where we started learning how to work together with each other because my system was so different than what his system was gonna be. I mean, I think the goal behind it is time. Like, like when you're sleeping at the trailhead before you have this big climb, you're not sleeping there to camp. You're sleeping there because you have to, because you have to get up at like 2 or 3 a.m. the next day. Like you don't want to spend, you don't want to have to get up at 2:30 a.m. instead of 3 a.m. because you have to tear down your tent.

SPEAKER_02: 2:13

Every brand you love, every product you admire started as just an idea. Sparked by a moment, shaped by a person, nurtured by a community. The Circling Podcast is proud to introduce Birth of the Brands from Oregon Media and Bend magazine. I'm Adam Stor. Join me as I sit down with founders from across Central Oregon and beyond. On this series, we follow seven brands that participated in the 10th annual Bend Outdoor Works Startup Accelerator Program. Commonly referred to as BAO, Bend Outdoor Work's primary mission is to help outdoor startups scale and achieve their wildest dreams. Ever wanted the Van Life experience without the Van Life price tag? Meet Kynevers and Kate Raver, the young entrepreneurs behind Wanderhut. A startup reimagining how outdoor enthusiasts sleep on the road or at the trailhead. Wander Hut's innovative hatchback tint system was born from their own frustration with uncomfortable nights before early morning adventures. The Wander Hut designs snapped seamlessly into your car's interior, transforming your hatchback into a spacious, ventilated, bug-proof sleeping setup without the hassle of pitching a tin. The idea started as a college project at Oregon State University Cascades and caught real-world traction when a stranger spotted their prototype in a Home Depot parking lot and inquired where to buy one. That moment of validation set Kai and Kate on the path from student concept to startup reality. Recent graduates of OSU Cascades Outdoor Products Program, Kai and Kate are making the leap from classroom project to real-world startup. And with mentorship from industry veterans and the Bend Outdoor Works community, they're tackling the challenges of manufacturing and growth. Kai's big picture vision and willingness to take risks, paired with Kate's meticulous eye for detail and a background in textile fabrication, give Wanderhut a strong foundation for its own adventure. You guys just got done traveling?

SPEAKER_05: 4:40

Yeah?

SPEAKER_02: 4:41

Where'd you guys go?

SPEAKER_04: 4:43

Uh, we spent a week in Greece and then three weeks traveling up Italy from kind of the southern tip up at the Dolomites. How was that? So amazing. Yeah. Yeah. It was a break from like school and bow and working on everything else, and then being able to just kind of like turn the brain off and just enjoy it.

SPEAKER_06: 5:06

It was a much needed reset, I think, because we were insanely busy before we left for that.

SPEAKER_02: 5:13

Yeah, I mean graduating college, really starting a brand. Yeah. Um working. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 5:23

Yeah. I know for me, like I was working full-time hours to try to save money for that trip. And then we had all of the bow commitments. And then it there it was just and then school was finishing up and like trying we have been helping OSU Cascades create this new maker space that has a lot more machinery to it. So we've been helping with that too. And it was just like I don't think I had a single day off for like two months.

SPEAKER_02: 5:49

Yeah. Why Greece, Italy, just would just any reason there?

SPEAKER_04: 5:55

I mean, I've I've wanted to go to Italy for a while now. I'm kind of a history nut. Yeah. And I was like, we need to go, you know, see all these different places. And then Kate was like, we also have to go to Greece while we're here.

SPEAKER_06: 6:08

Greece was my thing. Italy was his thing.

SPEAKER_04: 6:11

Give me some highlights. We gotta take a train on a boat, which is something I didn't know existed. A train on a boat.

SPEAKER_06: 6:18

They they load trains on tracks onto boats that have tracks. And then they they do their little piece of the course that's you know over the ocean, and then the tracks line up to tracks at the port. And so you just get off.

SPEAKER_02: 6:34

It's kind of like a ferry for train trains.

SPEAKER_04: 6:37

Exactly.

SPEAKER_06: 6:37

It was the right thing.

SPEAKER_04: 6:39

Neither had I. And when I saw it, I my mind was blown.

SPEAKER_06: 6:42

Well, we were so confused because we were looking at Google Maps at the route and we were like, it says we're going into the ocean. And then we started going into the ocean. We were like, what's happening? And then we realized that we were like, oh, it's a train on a boat.

SPEAKER_02: 6:55

That's funny guys. That's a fun memory to make together, too. Just get time together. And like, how did that like coming back to Central Oregon? Like what how how do you view where you live after being where you went?

SPEAKER_05: 7:11

So many people have asked me this question since we came back.

SPEAKER_02: 7:15

Because that's what travel does, right? It it kind of expands. Um I mean, we live in a bubble in Oregon. Massive bubble in a lot of different ways. Now more than ever, really. But um, you know, like I used to travel a fair amount when I was younger, and I haven't in a long time just because I've been in a different season of life. But there's there's life lessons and perspective that you can't gain in any other way, I don't think, other than travel.

SPEAKER_08: 7:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 7:44

I I guess coming back, especially so the last week of our trip was in the Dolomites.

SPEAKER_02: 7:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 7:49

And just like kind of hut to hut. Tell people what the Dolomites are. Most people probably know, but some probably won't. The Dolomites are mountain range that kind of goes through Italy and kind of up through Central Europe. And we were in kind of North Tar Terrell, I think was the area we were in. Yeah. Um, and it's just like towering cliffs on all sides. It was crazy. Um and then coming back to Central Oregon after that, it's not quite the same, but it you're so lucky to live here. I mean, we still like have mountains around us and the forest and the river going to like it. It made me appreciate how beautiful end was um as well as how beautiful everywhere else is.

SPEAKER_02: 8:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 8:33

But it's it's lucky to come back and not be like, oh, I live in like Kansas. Totally. So Hillsboro even. Or Hillsboro. Although you can't can't, you know, talk about on Hillsborough, Hillsborough's great.

SPEAKER_02: 8:45

Well, that's where you're from. Yeah. Yeah. What was life like growing up in Hillsboro?

SPEAKER_04: 8:49

It was pretty awesome. Uh, you know, you're like an hour and a half from the ocean, you're an hour and a half from Mountain Hood, you're out at sort of Portland. Um, there's forest pretty much all around you as well. Um so you're not quite as close to the mountains as you're in Bend, but growing up there we are my family was still camping, you know, twice a month out of our 2002 era van. So it would cram five or six of us in there and go and camp for the weekend and do road trips. And I was homeschooled for like a year or two, so we actually spent like a month living out of the van, uh just touring all the national parks kind of on the west coast up to like Colorado. So that's kind of where I got into camping just with the family. But Hillsboro for uh especially now, moving back there, get access to like Portland for design jobs.

SPEAKER_02: 9:41

Pretty pretty fun spot. Yeah, I lived my wife and I lived out there. My when I was in grad school, we lived in Hillsborough for part of the time, and my wife worked for the Hillsborough School District. We lived right next to Costco. Okay. Out there by the airport. It's a great spot right next to Costco.

SPEAKER_06: 9:56

Totally.

SPEAKER_02: 9:56

I mean, we were so poor, dude. Like we would we wouldn't like a date night for us was literally walking around Costco like sampling samples.

SPEAKER_06: 10:05

Our date nights are getting the Costco hot dogs.

SPEAKER_02: 10:08

Yeah. If we're lucky, the uh we're currently in that broke phase. It's a good spot to be. It's hard, uh, but I don't know. There's something good about experiencing kind of the those dry times where like you're counting every penny, and you know, like it teaches you a uh an appreciation and the value of a dollar. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 10:33

I mean, I think it makes us more creative too. Like the first tents that we made were an old REI tent that his parents gave us that we just cut apart and then resowed together because we didn't have the money to pay for that material. Yeah. And all the zippers and thread and everything.

SPEAKER_02: 10:49

Yeah. Creating something that's affordable is at least from my perspective and what I've learned about Wander Hut was is kind of part of the story of how Wander Hut came to be. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 11:04

I mean, I think that was the goal from the beginning was to have almost like a van life experience, but at like a budget level.

SPEAKER_04: 11:12

Totally. Yeah. Yeah. I I wanted to make something that I could afford. Yeah. I guess was my thinking behind it.

SPEAKER_02: 11:18

Yeah. So we're going to get into exactly what Wander Hut is for sure, is for listeners and and definitely people should get on your guys' website because really you need like the visual of what you guys offer is key. Um, yeah. And and I've been super impressed. You know, my partner and I, Dan, when we first started meeting everybody in this year's Bow cohort, like we were very impressed with you guys and like being the age you are and putting the effort into the vision that you have, and like it's it's just really impressive, man. So thank you. Yeah, yeah. I'm proud of you, both of you. Yeah, it's cool. And and a lot of other people are too. Like I after talking with like Naomi and Ryan and other like some of the Bow mentors, I mean, you guys brought a a really fun perspective and story to the team of people this year, as everybody did in their own unique way.

SPEAKER_06: 12:19

For sure.

SPEAKER_02: 12:19

I had a ton of fun with that program.

SPEAKER_06: 12:21

Oh my gosh, us too. It was like our dream, just in a room with a bunch of people who were talking about products and the industry. And I mean, that's like what we went to school for. It was like kids in a candy store.

SPEAKER_02: 12:32

Yeah, for sure. So living the van life, exposure day outdoors that kind of shaped your passion for being outdoors? Definitely.

SPEAKER_04: 12:41

Yeah. Um, and then especially like right when COVID started and everything shut down. It was just like get outside as much as possible.

SPEAKER_02: 12:49

So when did you graduate high school? 2021. 2021. Yeah. Same with you, Kate?

SPEAKER_06: 12:54

Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 12:54

Yeah. And you grew up in Colorado.

SPEAKER_06: 12:57

Yeah, Colorado Springs. Oh, no way.

SPEAKER_02: 12:59

Home of the Air Force Academy. Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 13:01

I went to high school on the Air Force Base.

SPEAKER_02: 13:03

Did you? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06: 13:04

Air Academy High School.

SPEAKER_02: 13:05

Yeah. Interesting. So did you did your family spend a lot of time outdoors as well?

SPEAKER_06: 13:10

Yeah. I mean, my dad has been an outdoorsman his whole life. Yeah. And his extended family also super outdoorsy. My brothers are into like climbing and mountain biking. And they make frequent trips to like the Utah Desert to climb some spires. And yeah, it's been around me my whole life.

SPEAKER_02: 13:28

Aaron Powell Being outdoors is the best. There's nothing that can replace, I think, the impact that nature can have on the psyche and and just you know makes you feel small. It humbles you, especially the further you get out there. You know, I can imagine the dolomites made you feel small.

SPEAKER_06: 13:47

Oh my gosh. Like tiny.

SPEAKER_02: 13:49

Yeah. Yeah. It's massive. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 13:52

I mean, seeing those peaks like tower over you, it's just it's kind of comforting. You feel so protected.

SPEAKER_02: 13:58

Yeah. It's hard work to like do all the things that you guys have done. Yeah. And you had kind of shared this story of your first pass with realizing the value of and how where your work ethic came from.

SPEAKER_06: 14:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 14:13

And and kind of the the scarcity of hard work at times.

SPEAKER_06: 14:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 14:17

Because anyway, share that story.

SPEAKER_06: 14:20

Yeah. It's a silly story.

SPEAKER_02: 14:22

But it it proves a good point.

SPEAKER_06: 14:23

Yeah. I mean, I think at the time I was five, maybe six. Um, and I was enrolled in gymnastics classes. And the way that we would end every single gymnastics class was by doing like 20 leg lifts hanging on bars. And so all of us would like line up on these bars and we'd sit there, and our teachers would be passing by, and they would have us count out loud so that they could make sure that we were doing all 20 leg lifts. And so I was there counting, you know, like one, two, three, four, like all the way up to 20. And the people next to me were like, one, five, seven, 10. And it like drove me up the wall. So I was always the last one there, getting to 20 when everyone else had just left. And I like remember one day I walked up to my teacher and I was like, nobody else is doing all 20. I'm hearing them. They're not doing all 20. And they just kind of like shrugged it off because they were like, oh, they're like five-year-old kids. Like, this is just what they do to fill their time. It's not anything serious. But I took it very seriously. And I like left that class, like bawling my eyes out. My dad felt so bad because he's definitely where I get my work ethic from. And it was like, I guess, my first run-in with like seeing how other people can cheat the system.

SPEAKER_07: 15:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 15:42

And it just like made me so sad. And he like, I don't r quite remember how he dealt with it because I was so young. But he was like, no, like it's just a good reflection on you that you are the last one in there, which I didn't understand at the time. It made me feel like I was worse than everyone else. And yeah, I that's like my first pass with hard work. The start of my ethic journey, I guess.

SPEAKER_02: 16:09

Well, ethics, but also seeing the value in hard doing hard things. Yeah, for sure. I read uh and I've I read two books in the last couple years that really helped me um appreciate the value in doing hard things. One is The Comfort Crisis by Michael Easter. I don't know if you've read that or not.

SPEAKER_05: 16:28

No.

SPEAKER_02: 16:29

Um, but he has, I think, this the quotes like uh discomfort's the price of admission to a meaningful life.

SPEAKER_05: 16:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 16:36

Like it's really it's really good to be uncomfortable and do hard things. And then the other one is this book called Grit by Angela Duckworth, and she kind of has the same like enthusiasm is common, but endurance is rare, you know? And uh again, you know, just to highlight kind of some values, I think, that I see in Wander Hut, you know, on in both your parts. And it's cool because you guys bring the you're a team doing this together. You're also a couple.

SPEAKER_05: 17:31

Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 17:31

Your previous life experience combined, how it's starting to shape this brand.

SPEAKER_06: 17:36

Yeah. I mean, I think it is Wonder Hut is a really good blend of both of us. And I also think that we have personality traits that blend really well together. Like anywhere where Kai might fall short, like you know, checking his email, I cannot stand. I cannot stand having that like little red bubble in the corner that's telling me that I haven't read something. So I'm like always on top of the emails. So it's it's just complimentary, I think.

SPEAKER_02: 18:03

Yeah. Yeah. Not the best with the small details. Yeah, that's okay, man. Yeah. It's also important to know what you're not good at. Yeah. Yeah. And you're lucky to have a partner that uh has strengths where you do have weaknesses. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 18:16

Yeah. And I mean, like, I personally am super risk averse. Like I would never in a million years start my own business on my own. That is just not in the cards for me. But like Kai's over here, that's like, he's willing to take all these risks left and right. And so like he's pulling me out of my comfort zone into that area where it's, you know, good to be uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_07: 18:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 18:37

And it's good for me, but I think it's also good for him to have like the side that's like, well, no, this could be risky.

SPEAKER_04: 18:43

For sure. Yeah. The impulsivity to do things is kind of where I get my motivation. Yeah. Just get that spark, and then I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna do this now. Um, but having somebody to balance ideas off of and being told maybe you should not do that. Yeah. And maybe you should think this through is it's a good thing to have. Yeah. I'm learning.

SPEAKER_02: 19:04

How did you each learn about OSU cascades? And and I mean, it sounds like from what you shared with me, you came over here with the specific purse purpose of pursuing the outdoor program or outdoor products program.

SPEAKER_04: 19:18

Um well, I actually came here and did a year and a half of engineering first. Oh, really? Yeah, for uh energy systems.

SPEAKER_02: 19:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 19:25

Um, so I heard about it. My my brother has a really good friend who uh lived in Bend. And so we visited him in Bend and he showed me the campus, and he was like, you know, you should think about going here, Bend is sweet. And I was like, nah, it's too small. I want to give it like a big school. And then I came back to Bend and I was like, wait, Bend is amazing. I'm totally gonna go to school here. And I was set on being an engineer, and then halfway through engineering, I was like, outdoor products sounds so much more fun. And so I had to pivot about a year and a half in to outdo products.

SPEAKER_02: 20:00

How was that received at home and just kind of Oh, my parents were like great, yeah, great.

SPEAKER_06: 20:05

His parents are like the most supportive people under the sun. I don't think there's anything that Kai would choose to do except maybe buy a motorcycle that they wouldn't support.

SPEAKER_04: 20:14

Yeah, but they they thought it was great. I I know I wanted to be a designer, so I thought it was gonna be the engineering to designer pathway. Yeah. But I think it's gonna be the designer to maybe architect or kind of more uh professional design masters.

SPEAKER_02: 20:29

So we'll see. We will see, man. How about you? How did you learn about this program?

SPEAKER_06: 20:35

Um, in a very silly way, again. Um I was in high school and I was trying to figure out like what I wanted to do, and I was like, well, I think Oregon would be a really cool place to explore, but I hate rain because you know, I'm from Colorado. It never rains. So like for me, when it rains, I'm like, ah, gotta stay inside all day long. I'm not not the trooper that like true Oregonians are. Um and so I remember having a conversation with my dad again, and I was like, I want to go to Oregon, but I hate rain. Like, is there anywhere in Oregon where it's not like pouring down all the time? And do they have a college? And he was like, Well, your one shot is Bend, Oregon, but I don't know if they have a college. So I did like a quick Google search, OSU Cascades popped up. And then I just kind of like browsed through what majors they offered and I saw outdoor products and I was like, okay, that sounds kind of fun because it combined the most of my passions, like being creative. I've been sewing since I was seven years old. Um, and it like it felt like it gave me the most options that aligned with things that I was interested in. Um, and I also love being outside too. Like growing up camping, we would have like family ski reunions every year. And um, so I've always been around outdoor gear. I had never at the time thought about making my own outdoor gear, but like once I saw that, I was like, this feels right. And so that's what I did.

SPEAKER_02: 21:50

Who taught you how to sew at seven?

SPEAKER_06: 21:52

Um, so actually, this little grandma in my neighborhood, she ran like legit sewing lessons out of her basement. She had like six stations set up. And then just all these like young kids from the neighborhood, we would like show up at a certain time and basically it was self-guided. So we would pick what we wanted to make, bring in like the pattern and the fabric, and then she would just help us get from like A to Z. And so I did that for like seven years. Um, and it was, yeah, at the time it was just a hobby and I thought it was fun. But I didn't realize that it would be like my life's work later on.

SPEAKER_02: 22:25

A skill set that complements your boyfriend's vision of a product.

SPEAKER_06: 22:29

And yeah, and I've since taught him how to sew, and he does a pretty good job.

SPEAKER_02: 22:33

So it's amazing. Yeah, it's working on it. What was the first thing you sewed?

SPEAKER_06: 22:37

So she had a couple like beginner sewing projects. One was like a little pin cushion, so like basically a mini pillow, just to like teach you the basics. But the first one that I picked was like this little purple dress that I made out of like satin.

SPEAKER_07: 22:51

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_06: 22:51

And I think it was a really ambitious one to take on as my first project, but like at the time I didn't know what I didn't know. And so I brought it in and she was like, Well, this is gonna be hard, but okay. And so she just sat with me through the whole thing and I got it done somehow.

SPEAKER_02: 23:08

Totally.

SPEAKER_06: 23:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 23:09

It's funny when I had uh Sharice in here with Gideop Glove, her daughter came in with her and recorded because her daughter is part of the inspiration of Sharice ultimately kind of sewing and you know, initially um quilting or uh crocheting the first Gideop gloves. Yeah, you know, and it and it was just like it's so fun to kind of reflect back on these coincidental stepping stones of life that lead to kind of this like opportunity if you're paying attention and it's really it's pretty it's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_06: 23:43

Yeah, that is so adorable that she brought her.

SPEAKER_02: 23:46

Yeah, it was fun, it was super fun. She was by far the youngest podcast guest that participated, and it did require a lot of editing.

SPEAKER_06: 23:53

Oh, I'm sure it did. Worth it though, worth it.

SPEAKER_02: 23:58

Totally worth it. Yeah, that uh the OSU Cascades program is is amazing. I mean, I so when I moved to Bend in '98, I ended up going to school a couple years later, but um at COCC. And at the time they had U of O had like a little bit of presence here, but there was no OSU Cascades like presence, and to see what it's grown into and the quality of the programs across the board. I mean, everything from you know ancillary healthcare professions to business, and I mean, it's uh you meet a lot of people now that have gone through programs, outdoor recreation, and are like plugging into the community after school, and it's it's pretty remarkable, man.

SPEAKER_06: 25:20

Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, I think like the most valuable thing that I got out of that entire program was just the people that I was able to meet because it's in Bend, Oregon.

SPEAKER_08: 25:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 25:31

Like, I mean, a bunch of the people that have been part of BAO in the past, like the reason we met them is because of OSU Cascades. Yeah. And like Naomi used to be a designer at Nike, and like she's super plugged in. She's gotten us um tours and interviews with like very high-up people in the design world.

SPEAKER_07: 25:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 25:50

So for me, like the classes were fun and cool, and I like I learned a lot of stuff. But like what I take away from that are all the connections that I was able to make.

SPEAKER_02: 25:59

That's usually how life works. Yeah. It's the relationships you make along the way, you know. Well, speaking of Naomi, um, thanks for connecting me with her.

SPEAKER_05: 26:08

Yeah. Of course.

SPEAKER_02: 26:09

So uh she her and I had a great conversation and uh play some audio for you.

SPEAKER_01: 26:16

Hi, my name's Naomi Morrison. I'm an instructor and the program coordinator in the outdoor products program at Oregon State University Cascades, located in Bend, Oregon. Prior to coming to this role, I graduated with a degree in apparel design. I was fortunate enough to go to Nike as a designer too in apparel design, and I was there for many years, about 21. In my time there, I held multiple design director roles in geography such as North America, as well as in global organizations. One of the things that I noticed in that role is we would be fortunate to host groups from middle schools and high schools that would come through, like our design studio, which is called Blue Ribbon Studio. And a lot of times I noticed that students would say, Oh, I had no idea that this was a career I could have. I didn't know that I could put my love for product uh into an industry role where I could make a good living. And just hearing so many of those stories over the years made me feel when I reached kind of a nice closing of my Nike chapter that I was really hoping to go into education and help connect with students and learners to help people find ways to learn that worked best for them because that was something I heard a lot as well. School has kind of a one size fits all delivery method, and if it's not a way that you learn best, sometimes you are not able to really feel confident in your ability, and that's something that I was hoping to change. Kai and Kate were in my very first class at OSU, and they were both sitting in the front row, um, very focused, and they're both really driven. That came through right away. Kai, very curious, um, kind of really thinks for himself, which you probably have seen working with him in Bend Outdoor Works. He definitely takes everything in, asks lots of questions, and forms his own kind of way forward. He pulls inputs from like a lot of diverse places and people. Um, and I think that's really kind of an amazing part of what shapes how he sees opportunity and how he brings it to life. Kate, same, um, but in a slightly different way. She really like goes through all of the steps and then adds her own kind of input on top. She's very sharp, great presenter, but she really like looks through all of the details of what is offered, understands it all, builds her mastery of the content, and then adds her other pieces on top. So they were really great to have as students in my first cohort. They definitely got me thinking a lot, and they really helped frame my understanding of what students and the program need. Well, it's interesting because uh another student from their class said recently in an interview that students were conducting of graduating seniors. He said the outdoor products program teaches you how to learn for yourself. And because it is a new major and something that covers such a wide range of products, right? Because students are working on hard goods and soft goods and gear, like Wonder Hut, really, you have to have hard goods and soft goods skills to really bring that product to life. And then I guess one thing I would add to that that I think Kai and Kate both do very well is when the program was being built, um, Chris Van Dyck, who had been kind of contracted by OSU to go out and research what the need was, has deep industry roots. And everyone he talked to said we need graduates who understand the ecosystem of the industry. We get a lot of people who really understand how to design, you know, they really understand how to market, but they don't know what manufacturing has to do, supply chain, like they don't see the big picture. And I think Kai and Kate's approach and their partnership is also a great example of what that could be. They do different outdoor things, they have different skills, they are really attuned to their community. And so as they're thinking about how Wander Hut works in the winter and how it works in the summer and what people need, they're always evolving it based on the feedback they get. Like they're very open to feedback, but they still retain their kind of vision of how that product can be better for the outdoor space. So I hope other students can follow that example as well. It's the best thing in the world. I think it's why we choose to do these jobs. Um, you know that students are only with you for a short period of time, and your goal is always to set them up for the future that they want to have. Like, how do you, you know, make sure that they attain a baseline across the class, but then how do you make sure that each individual student is taking away what they need to feel confident about their. Future. So I'm very impressed by both of them. I'm super proud of them. Um, and I hope Wander Hut is hugely successful. But I know I would also say even if Wander Hut is the beginning of a different vision, right? It's the first step. It might be the last step as well, but I have no doubt that Kai and Kate will do amazing things. They have the passion and the heart and the energy and the vision, the work ethic. So yeah, it's wonderful to have students like them. And just be around people like them in general. Not even as students, but just as humans. I feel like they have this kind of resilience. But I think I would say to not ever lose trust in their ideas and their vision. There's always moments, right, in any career or in any life where it feels like things just aren't working and you really question what you're doing. Um, but I hope they know that they bring like a clear line of sight to the future and not to lose heart in those times when things seem like they aren't going to work out. Because I believe they will.

SPEAKER_06: 32:47

She is just the sweetest. Oh my goodness.

unknown: 32:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 32:51

I love Naomi.

SPEAKER_02: 32:52

It's really cool to hear an educator with her credentials and her experience um learn how much or how she talked about how much she learned from her students, you know, which is which is rad. I mean, I think that speaks to like a a really mature educator, right? Yeah. And yeah, it it it also obviously speaks to the quality of that program and just kind of, you know, it made me want to go there, quite honestly.

SPEAKER_06: 33:21

Like, I mean, it was a very, very fun program. Um, but I mean, I think the reason that we have such a good relationship with Naomi is because we like openly criticized the program to her. And I think she like kind of touches on that, but in a really nice way in those audio bites.

SPEAKER_02: 33:37

Um Well, that's how things get better, right?

SPEAKER_06: 33:39

Well, it is, but I feel like for us it was a slightly different experience because we had tried kind of critiquing the program with other teachers, but they didn't respond to it the way that she did. For Naomi, she was like, This is my opportunity. Like, if I can help make this program better and hear this feedback, then I can help grow the program and have more satisfied people come out of it.

SPEAKER_04: 34:02

It was the first teacher I've had where we made a comment and later in the term the class actually got better, like as we went.

SPEAKER_06: 34:12

Instant like feedback in response to it, which was like unheard of for me because I feel like as students, oftentimes we feel kind of powerless, like it's someone else's guiding the entire process, and they give you the assignments and you have to do them, and then they're the one that grades you. And so sometimes it can feel a little like scary to try to critique anything because they have full control over what grades you end up getting.

SPEAKER_07: 34:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 34:34

But we had m numerous, I couldn't even count how many conversations we'd had with her about like small little gripes we might have had with the program or what we think we could use more of. And she just like instantly took that, turned it into action, and like has made it happen to the point where I like, I wish I started the program now because it has grown so much. And I feel like I've missed a lot of the improvements that she's made because I was caught the tail end of it.

SPEAKER_02: 35:01

What are some examples of some of those improvements?

SPEAKER_04: 35:03

Um, so for that that first class we had, um, I really wanted to go to something called outdoor retailer in Utah. Sure. Um, and I was trying to get like a class group to go. And my mom actually was like, here's the contact of the person who runs the outreach. And I was like, How'd you get that? And she goes, I just found it online.

SPEAKER_06: 35:26

I swear she's like a magician. She can find anything you need ever.

SPEAKER_04: 35:29

It was weird. But we got it. And then I went up to Naomi and I said, Hey, can we get a group of students to go to outdoor retailer? And she was like, Yes, I'll be the chaperone. Just figure out who wants to go. And so we got a little group to go the first year. But ever since then, now Naomi is making sure that each class has opportunities to go to companies like Gerber, Nike, uh, Keene, and all like the outdoor retailer stuff. And so they're doing like the I mean field trips really um to get that real industry experience and to like go talk to the real world designers and the manufacturers and sales team and stuff like that. So just the outreach has been amazing.

SPEAKER_02: 36:10

There's a lot to be learned at those trade shows and there's a lot of really cool people to meet. Um and I can't that's a that was a brilliant idea. Because I can't imagine it would surprise me if other outdoor program, like business college business focused programs were doing that.

SPEAKER_04: 36:29

Aaron Ross Powell The only other one is the one in in Utah. And they had a little booth there.

SPEAKER_06: 36:34

Yeah, and they're they're a little bit more apparel focused. Whereas we at OSU Cascades, I guess historically have focused more on gear aspect of it, I guess. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 36:44

I mean, and just like the industry as a whole. Anything from business supply chain, yeah, manufacturing, like yeah, it's a very holistic major.

SPEAKER_06: 36:52

It touches on like every single part of the outdoor product industry.

SPEAKER_02: 36:58

How about finance? Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 37:00

Yep. Yeah. We I mean, I would say half the classes we took were business classes and a lot of them were about finance. Um and like go-to market sprints. Yeah, go to market sprints, and you have to make sure that the money works out.

SPEAKER_02: 37:12

Yeah. Yeah. Every business has to pencil, man. Yeah, or else it's not a business, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 37:18

That's the unfortunate part.

SPEAKER_02: 37:21

But that's also a common experience with most startups, especially when you're operating on a shoestring budget and you don't have a ton of capital to like because yeah, if you if if resources were unlimited, it'd be easy. Not easy, but easier.

SPEAKER_06: 37:36

Yeah, easier for sure.

SPEAKER_02: 37:38

So yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 37:39

I mean, that's definitely our biggest roadblock because like we haven't even had a career yet. We're trying to fund a business.

SPEAKER_02: 37:46

Yeah, I'm right there with you. Except I do have a career and I'm still trying to fund a business. So when did you guys meet? Because you didn't know each other when you showed up in Bend.

SPEAKER_06: 37:59

Actually, we did. We did.

SPEAKER_04: 38:01

So uh I had a friend who actually was Kate's roommate for the first year at OSU, and we met through her.

SPEAKER_06: 38:09

Yeah. So basically we though they do it almost like Tinder kind of the way that they roommate match. Like you can chat with some people, and then once you find the right one, you just say, like, okay, we're roommates. And so I had picked this individual, and she happened to be one of Kai's really good friends in high school.

SPEAKER_07: 38:25

No way.

SPEAKER_06: 38:26

And so while I was like talking to her one night, she was like FaceTiming me. We were just trying to get to know each other. And she was like, Oh, I also have this friend of mine that's actually also going to OSU Cascades. You guys should totally talk. And so then we started talking, and then we ended up going on the same like orientation trip for all the freshmen and the rest is history.

SPEAKER_02: 38:46

Tell me about those first impression guy.

SPEAKER_06: 38:50

Um way to put him on the spot.

SPEAKER_04: 38:53

Yeah, that's what I remember talking to her, and she was just like, Oh my god, I love being outside. I love paddleboarding. Uh, I want to go to the like outer products degree. And I was like, okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07: 39:03

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 39:04

We should we should be friends. Yeah. That's how all good relationships start, man. Yeah, it's cool. I was like, I want to hang out with you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 39:13

I mean, it took us a while to actually start dating. We didn't start dating until like end of the first year. Yeah. I think.

SPEAKER_02: 39:20

Yeah. And then just through kind of doing life together, this idea for Wander Hut.

SPEAKER_04: 39:29

Um, it actually started as a school project.

SPEAKER_02: 39:32

Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 39:32

So we had a class with Todd Lawrence, uh, who was also in Dallas. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 39:38

Um, he's a really good teacher, especially when it's like about what he's interested in.

SPEAKER_04: 39:48

Yeah. Yeah. He he's amazing. But he had an entrepreneurship class. We were doing one of a few go-to-market sprints in the degree. And I was like, all right, I'm going to do something I just really want to make for myself. So I am a skier, climber, mountain biker, surfer, and I sleep a lot in the back of my car. And I never like really liked it that much. But like when you're at a trailhead, you can't do much, you can't really pop a tent. And I can't afford a rooftop tent because they're like a thousand dollars. And so I was like, I'm gonna make a tent for the back of my car. Um, and I just did the whole project on it. We did like the the costing, the design, all that stuff in class. Um, and then I was like, I actually want to make this. Um, and then Kate was like, okay, let's let's do it. Um, and that's when we got our first tent. We cut it apart. Uh I just taped it up to my car.

SPEAKER_06: 40:44

Yeah, patterning it was a nightmare. Yeah. Because all of those like curves and it's all organic shapes, and you it's hard, you can't really measure the angles on it.

SPEAKER_04: 40:54

I also don't have patience, so I didn't draft a pattern first, like Kate was telling me to do. Um, I just started cutting and taping.

SPEAKER_06: 41:01

Yeah, that was really where we started learning how to work together with each other because my system was so different than what his system was gonna be.

SPEAKER_02: 41:09

I just do things, yeah. These are good experiences to have early on, though. Yeah, definitely.

unknown: 41:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 41:16

Um, was there inspiration of like other products out there that kind of there's a Aztec Pontiac. Aztec Pontiac is a big one. Oh yeah. So they sold it with a tent.

SPEAKER_04: 41:25

I always think of breaking bad when I see when I think it's exactly. Uh but the tent on that thing, um, and there's like tarps you can like kind of attach to the outside of your car. Um, but I didn't like them because you have to like get out and strap them to all different parts of your car. And I was like, I'd rather just set up a tent at that point. Like, unless it's in the car, I don't want it.

SPEAKER_06: 41:48

I mean, I think the goal behind it is time. Yeah. Like like when you're sleeping at the trailhead before you have this big climb, you're not sleeping there to camp. You're sleeping there because you have to, because you have to get up at like two or three a.m. the next day. Like you don't want to spend, you don't want to have to get up at 2 30 a.m. instead of 3 a.m. because you have to tear down your tent.

SPEAKER_04: 42:08

Totally. Um, but for that first terrible prototype we had, I was picking up a bunch of sand at Home Depot, and a guy came up to me and he was like, Oh, what what is this? And I was like, Oh, it's it's just uh a thing, a thing I'm making. And he's like, Can I buy it?

SPEAKER_02: 42:28

And I was like, uh no. So you were at Home Depot picking up something unrelated, sand. Yeah, and you popped open your hatch back, and some guy just randomly walked by, saw it, inquired about what it was.

SPEAKER_04: 42:43

Yeah, so uh this was the guy's car looked like a Gambler 500 car for context. So really beat up, but it was the same car that I have. And he was talking to me, he's like, Oh, I'm a big camper. Like, where do you get this? And I was like, Oh, I'm I'm making these. And he was like, Oh, can I buy one? And I was like, I was like, You can't. Like, this is the only one I have, it's the only pattern, and it's kind of terrible. But you know, here's my Instagram. Follow me, and if I ever start making them, I'll hit you up. Um and that's the moment I was like, Oh, maybe I should make these. And so that's when I was like, okay, like I'll make them for friends and family if anybody wants them.

SPEAKER_06: 43:25

Um and then And then from there, like every other school project was also about this product idea. And so we started like building out basically the shell of a business without like actually committing to it just because you know, school is hypothetical.

SPEAKER_02: 43:43

Yeah, but what a great time to like do that.

SPEAKER_06: 43:46

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's great. I feel like it set us up so well for BAO because a lot of the things that they were having us do, we had already at least touched on.

SPEAKER_07: 43:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 43:55

Or like high-level thought about.

SPEAKER_07: 43:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 43:58

And so it was super helpful to have answers to things that I wasn't sure I would have answers to in BAO. It was great.

SPEAKER_02: 44:07

So for context, describe what a w the Wander Hud is.

SPEAKER_04: 44:12

So the the hatch tent is what the product's called. And so it snaps on the inside of your car and it's kind of held in with a little elastic strap when you close your hatch. But you pop open your hatch and it makes a little three-walled tent on the outside, and there's a zipper door, so you can get in and out. It adds a lot of room to the car. But the biggest thing is it adds ventilation and it keeps the bugs out.

SPEAKER_02: 44:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 44:37

So camping in the back of the car, especially like a nice mattress or something, is pretty comfortable, but it tends to get really hot and muggy and it's kind of cramped.

SPEAKER_06: 44:46

Especially if you have more than one person in there, it gets like humid and like moist almost. It's gross.

SPEAKER_04: 44:53

Um, and normally I just roll the windows down, but especially in central Oregon or Washington, there's a lot of mosquitoes. Sure, yeah. So you wake up and you're covered in bug bites, and there's like the little screens you can get for your windows, and you can get a fan, you could all these other little things to try to make it better. Um, but I wanted one thing to just make it better. Um so it solves almost all the issues currently. Um it's just you know, two seconds, however long it takes to open up your hatch, and then the tents deployed. It's like three minutes to install it once you have the snaps on your car. So it's like, in my opinion, the easiest solution for like car camping.

SPEAKER_02: 45:34

Which is a massive, like exploding kind of their market, right?

SPEAKER_06: 45:39

It's huge. I mean, I was just at I was working Overland Expo for my day job two weekends ago or however long it was. And it's huge. It's the biggest expo that I think I've been to. It was bigger than the the outdoor retailer? No, not outdoor retailer. Um, the fabric, functional fabric expo. It was bigger than that. And like every single booth had these giant rigs that were like at least$150,000. And I was like, if I could afford one of those, maybe I would, but they need they need this. They need this affordable version where you can get that van life experience, but you don't have to dish out the insane amount of money. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 46:25

Yeah. I mean, it makes so much sense. Clearly, there's been like a massive push outdoors since COVID and and people, I mean, young people oftentimes don't have the resources to even invest in like a$30,000 trailer, you know, and let alone the tow vehicle required to tow one. And you know, I mean, yeah, uh we used to car camp all the time after high school and in college, and and it's an obvious solution to a problem that you guys have come up with because it creates a much more comfortable experience. There's more room, but the benefit and what I see you guys doing that no one else does is the the it's so fast. Yeah, you know, I mean it's it's a no-brainer.

SPEAKER_06: 47:12

And I mean, like once you have it on there, you never have to take it off. Like we've put our bikes in the back of the car, he's put his surfboards in the back of the car with the tent on, and it doesn't affect anything. It's just there, and then you can use it as the tent when you need to.

SPEAKER_02: 47:28

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you see, I mean, I feel like every year I see more versions of the same kind of rooftop roof. Rooftop tent and um it's just which are cool, right? Yeah. But like again, time and the price never gets cheaper. No, it doesn't. Those things are not cheap. No, no. Yeah. Yeah, that's cool. So who's kind of your ideal customer? Like, I mean, we've kind of talked about Yeah, but I mean Kai.

SPEAKER_04: 48:00

Yeah. I mean I guess because that's a product I made for me, is like the people who already have like an SUV or hatchback, they don't really have the money to go for a rooftop tent or a van or something like that. They sleeping at trailheads, parking lots, kind of stuff like that all the time where you can't really set up a tent. Yeah. Um what did you name them?

SPEAKER_06: 48:22

Like the trailhead hero?

SPEAKER_04: 48:23

Trailhead hero is kind of the personification you put towards them. I like that. Um and then just like the overlanding camping people who just go camp to camp just to have fun. Um, really no destination in mind just to get outside. Um two two years ago, we slept out of the back of the car probably four nights a week.

SPEAKER_06: 48:42

Yeah. I mean, it was more than we were in our own houses, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_04: 48:46

Um and that's good live in mountains. Yeah. We were just cycling between camping spots and and like we had this whole group too.

SPEAKER_06: 48:53

Like other people that had made their own rigs, um, other people that just enjoyed camping. And so we would just have this group chat and we'd be like, hey, we're gonna be at this spot tonight, like pull up if you want to, and then we'd have this whole group. And that was that four nights a week. Like, I don't know if there's anything better we could have done for our mental health.

SPEAKER_04: 49:10

Yeah. So it's just you'd you'd wake up, you'd go to school, you'd go shower at home, and you go back outside. Yeah. You go, you'd go biking or riversurfing or whatever else in between. Um and it was great. Yeah. It was awesome.

SPEAKER_02: 49:24

Yeah, it's a it's a it's a good way to live. I mean, that's and it's like we said earlier, it's blowing up. I mean, there was a pretty good size article in a recent bin magazine issue on overlanding. And I mean, I've I I did an episode for for the circling podcast through bin magazine about a year ago or maybe longer with an old friend of mine, um, who I'm he was a patient of mine, and we just stayed in touch, and he has made a life for himself now out of living out it's called Pri um Primal Outdoors, I think is like his YouTube channel. And he's been at it for like I don't know, ten years now, and he converted an old Ford man and just kind of just that's what he does. Yeah, and it's this sense of simplicity and freedom, man. That is like I went out and we recorded his episode out um on Murder's Creek out in eastern Oregon, and he was just out there camping, and just that's what he does. Yeah, not not even camping, living. Yeah, you know, that's his home.

SPEAKER_05: 50:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 50:26

And uh yeah, I mean, for the for the right person in the right season of life, it there it seems like I remember driving home going, I could easily do that. Yeah. Yeah, it's fun, it's super fun.

SPEAKER_06: 50:40

Yeah, it's incredibly fun.

SPEAKER_02: 50:41

Yeah, yeah. Well, I I loved Kai when I asked you um any advice you would have for new entrepreneurs. You just you said simply just don't be afraid to ask for help. Um Ryan Price is another guy that you guys put me in touch with who is also like went through the Bend Outdoor Works program a couple years ago with his wife for their own product. Um and I mean I didn't I I had met Ryan a couple times. I didn't realize what a talented industrial designer.

SPEAKER_06: 51:15

He's like a celebrity in Bend. Like I can't tell you how many times I had heard his name before I had even met him. Like when I met him, I was like, finally, like I don't know how I haven't run into him yet.

SPEAKER_02: 51:26

Yeah, yeah. But uh he he had he shared his thoughts on um meeting you guys, his thoughts on Wander Hut, and then just I added a little bit of audio of just his life experience because you know, I mean, it's an interesting man. He's interesting, but it also like with his experience to really lean into Wander Hut, I think adds a lot of credibility and the vi he saw the vision of the problem you guys are trying to solve.

SPEAKER_00: 51:52

I met Kai first, actually, then heard about his project, and he approached me for some feedback. Um, Jesus, about two years ago, on um, you know, construction ideas and attachment methods uh for the Wander Hut into the Subaru. And uh so we we met there, started chatting a little bit, had an industrial sewing machine that uh let him use uh for a bit and uh to help them out with the prototyping side of things. And um, yeah, basically met him that way and then uh met uh Kate a few months later um and was you know honestly quite impressed with uh uh both of their attitudes and sort of conceptual uh you know ability on on bringing this uh to market. I'll speak towards overlanding specifically. There's a huge uh range of price points that people can you know buy vehicles or outfit their vehicles uh to use them as you know sort of uh adventure camping like rigs, uh, you know, on the weekend or whenever, going up to the mountain, what have you. You know, there's there's$1.2 million Earth Roamers. Um, and then you know, all the way down to you know just sleeping in your tent. Definitely a big fan of uh overlanding and uh um you know just getting outside as much as possible. And and the the vehicle uh sort of supported adventures is I think going to be become a growing segment uh of getting outside for a lot of different people. So the cool thing about the Wander Hut is uh, you know, for for younger people or or anybody really, but um it's it's it's an interesting price point that basically turns your vehicle into uh a sleeping structure very quickly and affordably. So um I think that's what drew me to it. It's a very simple solution uh to get outside and sleep in your rig. One great way that they thought about it was how can we keep this super simple, straightforward, as universal as possible. Um, but you know, the the the biggest thing in my mind is this the simplicity of it. And uh um oftentimes the simplest designs are the best ones. And uh, you know, a lot of designers forget that throughout the years, but uh or or get pushed in different directions. But I I think they did a great job of just um finding the the the core like element of what the product is and and what it does, and then uh you know run with it from there. So hi, my name's Ryan Price. I'm uh industrial designer. My background's definitely in uh soft goods, bags, you know, pretty much anything that's sewn. Uh and uh they asked for some advice, and I've got a lot of uh history in the uh manufacturing side of things. So I've been really fortunate to work with some uh globally recognized brands over the years. Uh I first started out of college with the Kine and Hood River for three years and uh loved every minute of working with them. Uh then I'm switched over to Quicksilver, which happened to be in Australia. It was a director of design for the Global Bags division, which was super fun, got to travel the world constantly. And uh see, 2007 I started Motive Collective, which is a design consulting firm. We've done a lot of work in uh action sports, outdoor, uh tactical, the pet industry, uh medical, and then you know, general lifestyle bags for a bunch of major brands, and then all the way down to startups, which is really fun. In the last couple years, I've helped co-found Broke Supply with my wife, uh, which is an equestrian saddlebag company. Uh, we went through the Bend Outdoor Works program in 2023, and uh also co-founded a vehicle organization company uh called Onward Supply. We're three years in uh to selling now, and it's growing quickly. And then uh Don Coolio, uh, which is the third brand I'm involved in, is uh basically a soft cooler brand uh that's gonna bring a lot of fun and uh disruption to the sown cooler market. So but yeah, live and breathe uh uh bags. Sounds cheesy, but it's true. So after going through the process with a couple of these different projects, uh, I am completely obsessed and passionate about uh being an entrepreneur uh and owning a brand uh that builds a culture and things like that. The toughest part of it is definitely the cash flow and uh having, you know, you really gotta have the grit to weather the storm until you can start getting paychecks and you know, help you basically feel like you're working for free for several years and then you know stuff starts to happen, which is you know exciting every moment along the way. But financially, uh I think once you get past uh the grind of not getting a paycheck and that starts coming in, then it it'll all be incredibly worthwhile. Keep up the good work. You guys are crushing it and uh happy to help uh wherever I can and uh can't wait to see you guys out uh in the market and uh making some Wonder Huts for my old rigs.

SPEAKER_02: 57:19

I love that um you know your advice was asked for help and you asked Ryan and he answered, which is like not uncommon in this town. Yeah, no, you know, like whether it's entrepreneurship or really anything, I think Bend is so unique in that regard. But uh yeah, it's it's it's amazing.

SPEAKER_04: 57:41

Yeah. Even before Bao, which was kind of funny, we had our own little version of Bao in my head. Um, we had five or six people that I was kind of rotating between, asking for advice on on business stuff, legal stuff, uh manufacturing, and just all any any question that I could think of. Yeah. Um, because I didn't want to bug one person too much. Yeah. So I was I was spreading.

SPEAKER_06: 58:03

You gotta rotate.

SPEAKER_02: 58:04

Yeah. For sure, man. And I've learned personally as well. Like, I mean, this is a perfect example. Like, I didn't know how to do this. And like I had this a very similar experience. Like, if you ask people with a specific question that shows you've kind of thought through it, people are more than happy to like give you their opinion or direct you in, you know, the right the right trajectory to kind of pursue what you're trying to figure out.

SPEAKER_06: 58:32

Yeah, and I think we were extremely fortunate to have still been students at the time because it made it so much easier to ask for help. Like people pretty much expect that from someone who's learning and in school. So we have we could just hide behind the excuse and like walk up to people and be like, hey, I'm a student. I'm working on this, and I know you're like a big name in the industry. Like any thoughts? And yeah, that just made it so much more approachable to ask for help.

SPEAKER_07: 58:56

Sure.

SPEAKER_06: 58:56

But I think it's helped me realize the importance of it, and I will definitely continue to ask for help. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 59:04

Yeah, this town kind of has a way of just like what you need and eventually will just kind of come to you if you want to.

SPEAKER_02: 59:11

Yeah, it's like the perfect there's enough people here with enough diverse experience, but it's also small enough to where kind of you don't get lost in the in the population size. Yeah, you know, like everybody kind of knows someone else who knows to start to learn names. Yeah, just for sure.

SPEAKER_06: 59:29

Yeah, I also think that like if you live in Bend, you're bound to have a common interest with the person next to you just because it's such it's like grounded in outdoor activities. Like that is why people come to Bend. So it just makes it a lot easier to build those relationships when you know that the person that you're bumping elbows with, like, obviously loves to be outside too.

SPEAKER_02: 59:50

Yeah. Yeah. How did you guys learn about Bao?

SPEAKER_04: 59:54

Um, so Naomi? I mean Naomi was how we got in, but uh two years ago uh we had an invite from I think uh a roommate, Soren and Ryan. Uh they were doing the kind of pitch competition in October. Uh-huh. And Soren was like, Do you want to go with us? This is a thing called Bow.

SPEAKER_06: 1:00:15

For reference, Soren is our roommate who works for Ryan at Onward.

SPEAKER_04: 1:00:19

Yeah. Okay. So we had a kind of that's how we got our connection to Ryan is through him. Um and we were like, Yeah, let's let's go. This sounds fun. It sounds like there's gonna be like some kind of educational stuff in the morning. Kind of like boot camp. Yeah, boot camp's pretty cool. And then you get to go like sit through the pitches. Um and that was super cool. Um, just even just for that little thing. We met a lot of really cool people. Um and I thought about doing the Ben Venture Conference pitch thing. Um, but I was talking to some people, and it sounds like it's mostly tech. Sure, it goes through that. Yeah. Um there's a few products. Uh and then Naomi was like, you guys should go do bow. Yeah. Because that's a little bit more up your alley. Um, and I was like, okay, you know, how do we get in contact? And she goes, Oh, I already got you in contact. Um, go talk to Meg. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:11

And I was like, apparently Naomi and Meg take the same Pilates class.

SPEAKER_04: 1:01:16

And that's how that's how they were introduced. Um and I was like, okay. So I I sent the email. Uh we did the little interview thing with Meg and Gary, and we basically We just waited until it started. Um it was one of those things where we didn't really know what to expect. Yeah. I was scared. I was scared for sure. Um and then luckily the OSU kind of gave us all the preparation we needed. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:48

At the beginning, imposter syndrome was like it was real for me at least. I don't know about you.

SPEAKER_04: 1:01:53

And real is talking about how, you know, they've worked at snowboarding companies for 10 years or started their companies and done whatever else.

SPEAKER_06: 1:02:00

So and like the other businesses that are a part of it too, like they've had the opportunity and the time to like, you know, make some revenue from it already. And like we have it. So that that was another piece of it too for me.

SPEAKER_02: 1:02:12

Really early stages. Yeah, I can relate with all that the imposter syndrome, the um yeah, just ignorance. You don't even know, you don't know what you don't know. You know, for me, a big part of it was like um learning how to view a business through the lens of an operating budget and just how important that is. Supply chain initially wasn't such a big part of story booth. Now it's becoming that because of our booth partner is is Scandinavian. So like, you know, that's but what I learned in Bao and being able to lean into those mentors about even just some of the basic questions about importing and yeah, it's it's a phenomenal resource, man. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's cool.

SPEAKER_04: 1:03:01

It was it was nice because we kind of mentioned it, the the outdoor product study was pretty broad. Yeah, and it gave you a really good breadth of knowledge, but it really didn't go super detailed on a few things. And a lot of the stuff is really hard to get detailed on unless you like have the data and like the thought behind it to go in detail on it. So Bao is great because it actually like pinpointed those things and we could dive deep into like an hour and talk about like just your why or just your like your costing, all these little things. And we couldn't do that in the degree because you don't really have an example to do, like especially like for yourself, you're motivated enough to like actually get into the details. So having that opportunity with people there who do that for a living, be able to dive in with you was like mind-blowing to kind of yeah, it was a game changer. Yeah. Where do people find Wonder Hut? Uh we're still technically pre-production, but there is a website, WonderHut.co, um, and there's a wait list on there. Um currently the only model we're working on is for the third gen outback. Um, we are going to expand that line to more cars eventually. Um but it's on there, or these are the Instagram, which is also wonderhut.co on Instagram. And we only have an Instagram um because if I have too much social media, I start just getting on social media. Totally distraction.

SPEAKER_02: 1:04:21

Yeah. Yeah. It's it's bad. But um signal and noise, right? That's this concept I've come up with lately. And you touched on it, Kate, which was like, you know, your advice to entrepreneurs was like do whatever you can when you can, you know, but being focused on what those things are and not getting distracted with noise in the background is is requires a lot of discipline and hard work, which goes back to how we started our conversation.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:50

I mean, like with our specific product too, like getting into those like crosshairs and like things outside of what we're doing right now, so easy. Because we're like, well, we're only making it for the third gen outback. That's cutting out like so many people who could be potential customers. So we need to figure out how to expand to other car models, but we haven't even figured out this car model yet. And so it's like it's been super helpful because both Ryan and I think the entire Bao team, they were like, no, you just need to focus on what you have right now because it's good. And we're in Bend, Oregon, and that's like the most common car here.

SPEAKER_02: 1:05:24

Subaru. Yep, Subaru as well.

SPEAKER_06: 1:05:27

Man, yeah. And so hearing that feedback was super helpful because it just it gives you a clear path as opposed to being like, well, I need to work on this and I need to work on that and this thing over here.

unknown: 1:05:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:05:39

Yeah. That that was one thing that I really took away from Bao was not getting distracted with be I have a and it's still something I struggle with, is like because I'm an idea person, but yeah, you know, and you can relate with that guy. You know, but being like being focused on what are the next three to five things I can do today to, you know, get me to where I want to be tomorrow. Yeah. You know, and just a day at a time.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:05

Yeah. Because there's so much to think about, and it is so easy to think about things ahead of time before you really need to. And like I am a future thinker for sure. That's like where my mind lives. But you can't do that. You have to you have to work in the now and get to the point where you can you can look at those things. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:24

And or or, you know, like find that balance of here's where, you know, here's where we want to be in five years. How do we get there? You know?

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:32

I mean, I think if I was left to my own devices, I would just live in the five years. Like that's where I would be thinking like 100%.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:39

Yeah. The the vision statement um process was really uh um educational for me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:47

Yeah. It was helpful for me too, because it like taught me how to use my thinking five years in the future to like guide my thinking now.

SPEAKER_07: 1:06:54

Sure.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:55

Something that loops it back is more helpful to me than someone just telling me to think in the present. Like and I'm like, why?

SPEAKER_04: 1:07:02

It's just funny because I don't think more than about a month ahead. That's about how far I can like conceptually another reason.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07:11

Why you two are a good team. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I can easily see, you know, like whether it's Subaru or some other car manufacturer or brand, like you know, this seems like an obvious like partnership that you could develop with them, you know.

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:29

Just like Yakima does with Subaru, you know, like Yeah, and especially because they have like wilderness editions that are like meant for overlanding, it it does seem like it would be a good relationship.

SPEAKER_04: 1:07:41

Yeah. Have you guys thought about exploring that?

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:44

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 1:07:44

Yeah. Yeah, that's been the uh the wannabe exit strategy. Yeah. Just sell this idea off to Subaru and just have them make these for their car. All right. But you know, we gotta sell a few first before we get the. Well, it's good that you have a wait list. Yeah, we have a few people. The only problem is um we have enough people now telling us they want them for like foresters. Yeah. That now we're like, okay, so maybe we do have to start making the forester whatever. Or maybe it's the the Lexus, you know, whatever else, or the the forerunner.

SPEAKER_06: 1:08:15

Which like I have no doubt that we're gonna get to other car models and makes eventually. But yeah, and I think until we have like a go-to manufacturer, we're definitely sitting at the Subaru Outback.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:08:28

For now.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:29

That's a good spot to be though. Yeah. It's a g it's a what an iconic car, man. I remember when because when I was in high school, the car of choice was the Subaru Loyale. Oh, yeah. You know? And and then I remember the Outback came out and they were just like, what? You know? And it's still, I mean, there there's you see them everywhere.

SPEAKER_06: 1:08:50

Yeah. We both have the same Subaru Outback, actually, like same color, same generation.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:56

So you say third generation, what years is that? Uh 2003 to 2009. Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 1:09:01

Yeah. Yeah. It it also does fit the second generation. Okay. Um, you just have to move the snaps around a little bit, we've learned. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:09:10

And that's a whole I mean, I remember you talking about, you know, trying to solve for the problems of of the snaps and where to get them, how to how to attach them, and but you're making progress on that.

SPEAKER_04: 1:09:23

Aaron Powell We're trying to. That was probably we've we've been thinking about Wonder Cut for about three years. Um from year one to year two.

SPEAKER_06: 1:09:32

That was the problem.

SPEAKER_04: 1:09:33

The problem was how you actually attach this to the car. Sure. Because I was terrified that people aren't gonna want to put, you know, tiny little metal screws into their car. Um and then I I took a poll on a Facebook group I'm in, which is like third generation overlanding servers. And I said, Who's who would modify their car? You're like 90% of the people are like, of course we would. Yeah. Like look at the group you're in. Yeah. And so that's like the target market is those people. So then I was like, okay, so that's not gonna be an issue if people wanted to modify their car if you're overlanding.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:04

The only thing it's it's also barely a modification. It's it's screwing in these metal snaps into your plastics.

SPEAKER_04: 1:10:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:11

And you can still open and close your car no problem. Yeah. You bear you don't even see them.

SPEAKER_04: 1:10:18

But I mean, that was we we went through like Velcro zippers, trying to like stuff things into like where the plastics meet together so you can just like clip them on. And I mean, it was a year. That's what we mean. That's what I asked Ryan first. I was like, how do you connect hard goods and soft goods like easily? Uh we asked Timothy about that as well.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:38

Yeah, we asked some people from Roughware about it.

SPEAKER_04: 1:10:40

Like so, and then we all we just circle back to snaps and then adhesive back snaps as well. We're trying to figure out for the people who don't want to modify their car. Yeah. Um, but those are just so expensive. Super expensive. Sure. So I'm trying to get those a little cheaper and a little stronger currently. The adhesive isn't quite what we wanted it to be.

SPEAKER_02: 1:10:58

So Yeah, these are all solvable problems. Oh yeah. Yeah. So what's the plan? Like what this summer you guys are working day jobs. Where do you guys work?

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:09

So I work at Fial Raven.

SPEAKER_02: 1:11:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:11

Um I was happy. Yeah, they're super cool. Um, I was originally hired on as their tailor to do repairs and stuff for warranty in there, but they just changed how they do their warranty stuff, so now I'm working on the floor.

SPEAKER_04: 1:11:24

Okay. Uh I'm doing some freelance design for the University of Arizona. I'm designing and manufacturing pressure suits for their uh SAM uh at the Biosphere 2. It's like a Mars and Moon analog they have down there. So we're we're basically making uh LARPing spacesuits, so live action roleplay spacesuits. So LARPing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:11:48

Apparently that's the term.

SPEAKER_04: 1:11:49

I don't even know this term. Live action roleplay. It's like uh I mean people pretend to be like knights in the woods. Uh you know, they're they're doing Mars and Moon.

SPEAKER_02: 1:11:57

I love that kind of there. Oh no, there still is.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:02

Someone that I worked with was part of it, and they all came in one day looking for him. It was it was a little strange.

SPEAKER_04: 1:12:10

Um but yeah, so we're making making two pressure suits for them to go like 16 PSI so they can yeah, simulate being on the moon. Yeah. With which is nuts. Which is nuts, yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:12:22

Right on, you guys. I mean, anything else that w we should talk about that we didn't?

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:28

I think we covered pretty much all of it.

SPEAKER_02: 1:12:30

Yeah, I think it's a it's a rad brand story. Thanks. Um, yeah, I'm like I said, I I'm super impressed with you guys. It's it's gonna be fun to see how this continues to evolve and grow, you know. Yeah and and what your like the skill sets that you're learning are gonna be not only benefit Wander Hut, but any other pursuits that you guys put your, you know, set your mind on.

SPEAKER_04: 1:12:53

That's like the biggest thing is even if this fails, it's like we're gonna have the coolest portfolio piece. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:00

Yeah, and that's been my mindset on it the whole time because I'm risk averse. I'm like, well, you know, if it fails, I just have this really cool thing that I tried really hard on to show other people.

SPEAKER_02: 1:13:09

Yeah. Yeah. And you guys are just self-funding it as you go.

SPEAKER_04: 1:13:13

Yep. That's right. That's that's been the biggest thing. Yeah. Um, I mean, as a college student, it's time is what you have. Yeah. Uh but now we don't have money. Yeah. But now we have a little bit more time. Yeah. So now it's like, well, we can make them, but that isn't really gonna be like financially, you know, it doesn't really float the boat. Um so we're trying to find factories right now to do an MOQ, which we have a connection again, thank you through Ryan, uh, to a factory that we're in talks with, but they're dealing with They're dealing with the whole tariff situation right now.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:49

So as a really small company that hasn't even like sold anything yet, we're like definitely on the back burner. So that's probably our biggest issue now is how to get like a manufacturer to take us seriously right now when they're trying to put out dumpster fires left and right.

SPEAKER_04: 1:14:06

Yeah. I mean it's affecting everybody. Yeah. Small amount queues and and a tight budget. We kind of don't get ignored, but we definitely get pushed aside a little bit.

SPEAKER_02: 1:14:15

Yeah, it you know, it's it requires flexibility on the timeline and patience.

SPEAKER_06: 1:14:20

Which like we have that.

SPEAKER_04: 1:14:22

Yeah I think we're not we're not in a rush, which is nice. Yeah. We're just here to hopefully make a cool product. And the nice thing is too, it gives us enough time to help other people. Like when people are like, Oh, I want one for the Forester. Since we're still waiting for our manufacturer to get back to us, sure. We can kind of start doing the patterning for those things while we're waiting. So we're not we're not idly twiddling our thumbs, but uh we're just kind of redirecting our energies towards and sending a lot of emails.

SPEAKER_02: 1:14:50

A lot of emails doing what you can when you can. It's also you know, one the other thing that from Naomi's audio um participation that was encouraging is to hear someone who has had the career that she has had to to comment on everybody has those seasons of like this isn't going as expected or planned, or doubts creep in. I mean, that's basically like multiple times every day in my life. I have those thoughts, you know. But to normalize that is refreshing, you know, because I don't know any entrepreneur I've met that hasn't had those moments of doubt or imposter syndrome.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:29

Yeah, I mean, how could you not? You're taking such a big risk.

SPEAKER_02: 1:15:32

Totally. Yeah, cool. Well, thanks for doing this, you guys. Uh thanks for having us. I wish you all the success in the world.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:42

Same to you.

SPEAKER_02: 1:15:42

Yeah, well, yeah. We'll see. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:47

So will we.

SPEAKER_02: 1:15:49

Yeah. Uh we got the, you know, the one of the goals of doing this is so that um before the pitch event in October, people can listen to the episodes of all the different brands in the cohort and get a better understanding of who the people are, more than just the few minutes that we have on stage. So good luck in your preparation. You too. Yeah. Any any fun summer like adventures coming up?

SPEAKER_04: 1:16:17

Trying to get to the San Juan's, down the redwoods, Crater Lake, too. Just a few of the local spots working like seven days a week, I feel like right now between everything.

SPEAKER_02: 1:16:26

So totally. The hustle is real. Yep. This is not a cheap town to live in. No.

SPEAKER_06: 1:16:32

Yeah. We we got our break and now it's like nose to the grindstone again.

SPEAKER_04: 1:16:36

Which is hard running a company that the whole point of it is to get outside. Yeah. And then you feel like, oh now my company isn't letting trapped inside. Yeah. Totally. So that's been something that I've been kind of trying to balance out. It's not take away the uh the adventure in the adventure company.

SPEAKER_02: 1:16:55

Because the adventure inspires the the brand, right? Yeah. It's I I can relate with that big time.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:00

And it's like you slowly lose touch because like our product we love so much because we use it all the time and we see all of the benefits that it can provide us. But then when you're constantly working on it, you don't have the time to go use it. So you're just like slowly creating this divide between you and your own product.

SPEAKER_02: 1:17:17

Yeah. It requires a lot of intention on how you manage your time.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:21

Yeah. And like what we've started doing is we're just justifying it all by being like, this is a marketing trip. We're gonna go take so many pictures, and it's we're still gonna be working on the brand, but we're still getting outside.

SPEAKER_04: 1:17:30

Just call it a business expense. Yep. That's what we're doing.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:32

Which you know, it is, but in our brains, we just want to go have fun.

unknown: 1:17:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:17:39

All right, you guys, that's a good spot to end. Thanks for coming in and doing this. That was super fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:44

Yeah. Thanks for having us. Thanks for having us.

SPEAKER_02: 1:17:45

So uh definitely everybody get online, wanderhut.co. Um follow them on Instagram and uh stay tuned for I guess market availability.

SPEAKER_05: 1:17:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:17:58

And if you have a third generation Subaru, get on that wait list. On that wait list.

SPEAKER_04: 1:18:02

And if you don't, get on that wait list with a car you want to see so we know which car to do next. Yeah, that's cool.

SPEAKER_02: 1:18:09

All right, guys, have a good one. Thank you. On the next episode of Birth of the Brands from Bin Magazine and Oregon Media. If your fridge looks like a graveyard of half-used sauces, this story is your reset. I sit down with Melanie Jenkinson, founder of Hallet the Spoon. Melanie left agency life to create single-served sauces and fruit dust that make real food fast, flavorful, and waste-free. From Ohio to Ireland to Oregon, her journey shaped a brand that treats convenience as a path to better eating, not a shortcut.

SPEAKER_03: 1:18:53

It's making um healthy, brighter food more convenient and accessible and is affordable. Um, whether you're in a food desert or in the backcountry on a trail, uh, we're making packs of sauce that you could just put on bowls or salads, use it as a marinade or dip. So we're just making healthy food more accessible. Um until now, we've all you can look at a bowl of rice and chicken and it's just think of the work behind making that flavorful. So this is just putting all those healthy, bright flavor things into one pack, put it on there. Um, people should be using more of their time to do things that they want to do. Not if you don't want to be a cook or a chef and that's not something you find interest in, there should still be healthy, accessible options for you. So that's where we come in.